Figuring out how to open my dextox pathway

[JenniferS]

Hello friends,
A little history-- I am almost 29
I had severe PPD/PPP/anxiety after baby#1 born 8/2004 got off all meds 4/2006
Lots of cavities, cervical dysplasia, miscarriage 2/2006 with hemmorage

Started moving TF from super low-fat (was quite vegan from 10/2005-3/2006) in 3/2006
Went to Julia Ross' clinic in 8/2006-helped with nutrient therapy and amino acids. Diagnosed with multiple food allergies IgG--gluten, dairy, egg, tomatoes...Main issue is arthritis feelings, anxiety/irritability
Also diagnosed with Lyme--Took 6 rounds of abx before realizing that was a bad move. Quit abx3/2007, suppotred immune system..have been symptom free for almost 2 years
Also diagnosed with pyrolluria--zinc levels are now up
Main issue for depression seemed to be low-nutient levels. Adrenals were off but not horribly. Thyroid was normal (and they are very good at detecting throid issues at that clinic)

So far-
No mental problems. Feel good. Rarely feel panicky at night..resolves with eating more protein (esp red meat), less carbs and a little magnesium.
Hemoglobin good but not storing according to ferritin numbers. Had low vitamin D--supplement with HVCLO and D3..getting tested again soon.
Cervial dysplasia resoved as of last appointment 6 months ago. But I did have an ovarian cyst burst at that appointment during my pelvic (my OB is pretty rough!)..They did an ultrasound and it showed fluid. I have felt a dull ache that comes and goes there for years.....still feel it and wondering if it is something digestive.

Issues Now--
Had a baby 2/2008--started having gallbladder issues in November and saw my ND. Taking NOW Super Enzymes..Just started Standard Process AF BetaFood

Still have multiple food allergies.
(I am breastfeeding)

What I know--
I know I need ferments (I do saurkraut and juice kefir) and should probably start green smoothies.

I think I am a slow to moderate Phase 1 detoxifier because I used to be very sensitive to drugs (caffine, anasthesia) BUT I am less sensitive now...maybe detoxification is improving.

I probably need methionine since I read that pregnancy (estrogen excess) causes
stagnation of bil in the liver and can cause gallbladder issues. The pain actually started THE DAY I started cutting back on protein and adding more fat (even though I had not eaten low fat for years)

I think I need milk thistle--I have an unopened bottle from Herb Pharm. (HOW MUCH SHOULD I TAKE? I AM BFing a 13 month old)
I drink dandelion root tea.

Need more excercise--even though I do move a lot I need a more vigorous activity.


I pretty much eat GAPS legal foods since I don't tolerate starch/grains well. My main foods eat beef, chicken, broth, butter, coconut oil, berrries, brassicas, salad, caraway saurkraut, juice kefir, carrots, onions, garlic, lentils, coconut milk, lots of spices, nuts, seeds, squashes, natural PB.....

I should have acess to raw goat milk in a month or so to try out in kefir form.
My ND is also really into liver support so I can go to her for help if I get stuck along the path. We are going through a financially challenging time right now and I want to keep working on my gallbladder/IgG issues.

Thanks so much. I am so grateful to have a place to work through this!
JenniferS

[JenniferS]

Adding--
Pyrollurics need cysteine
Low levels of cyteine can lead to cervical dysplasia
Body sythesizes cysteine from methionine
Cystine is found in high protein (animal) foods
NAC increases levels of gluthanione

This may explain one cause the cervial dysplasia on the mostly vegetation vegan diet. Since I have pyrolluria that probably exaplains why I do SO much better on a higher animal protein diet (that includes liver). I feel like superowman after I eat liver. I think I have a high need for Bs and proteins.

[JenniferS]

I hope it is okay to have an ongoing discussion with myself here! I is really helping sort out my thoughts while baby is napping!

So, if I am a slower Phase I detoxifier and I need methioine and cysteine that would explain why I feel good on my diet of animal protein, brassicas, liver, krauts--the foods that supply those animo acids. I think that is why my liver/gallbladder got feeling bad when I tried to cut protein for fat. My slower detoxifying liver said no and gallbladder started hurting. Hmmm..I wonder if that makes sense. My nutritonist at the clinic thought I needed a lot of protein because my family is Scandinavian/Welsh/British....

QUESTION--Will I ALWAYS be a slower phase I detoxifier? Even though I am not as sensitve to drugs ect as before I still get tispy on a small amount of alcohol...My father is the same way. Is it genetic? (He is bipolar, needs protein, and probably has pyrolluria)

[Pat Robinson]

Will be back tomorrow, going out for the night.

You sound very informed already. We can help trouble shoot and brain storm with you.

I was reading this forum last night for hours: Plant Poisons and Rotten Stuff - The Blog: http://blog.plantpoisonsandrottenstuff.info/category/food-chemical-...

Phases of Detoxification: http://www.herbs2000.com/h_menu/det_phases.htm

Sulfur Metabolism:
http://www.canarys-eye-view.org/metabolic_basis/sulfur_metabolism/i...
http://cemmed.wordpress.com/

Introduction to Amino Acids: http://www.innvista.com/health/nutrition/amino/intro.htm

GABA, and DIY for bipolar disorder: http://blog.plantpoisonsandrottenstuff.info/2008/10/29/gaba-and-diy...

Methyl donors: http://blog.plantpoisonsandrottenstuff.info/category/vitamins/methy...

Neurotransmitters: http://blog.plantpoisonsandrottenstuff.info/category/the-brain/neur...


HTH, Pat

[Shannon]

I don't have time to go in depth right now, but I wanted to ask, have you looked at B6 for the pyrolluria/depression? WAPF has an article about forms of B6, but I don't think it's online yet. The gist is that raw animal forms are better, and the bad forms (cooked/plant) can compete. Avocados and bananas are the exception - they're both good sources.

Magnesium and B6 are needed to make cysteine from homocysteine. Supping cysteine would help bypass that step, but your homocysteine might get really high - a risk factor for midline defects and blood clots among other things.

[JenniferS]

Shannon said:

I don't have time to go in depth right now, but I wanted to ask, have you looked at B6 for the pyrolluria/depression? WAPF has an article about forms of B6, but I don't think it's online yet. The gist is that raw animal forms are better, and the bad forms (cooked/plant) can compete. Avocados and bananas are the exception - they're both good sources.

Magnesium and B6 are needed to make cysteine from homocysteine. Supping cysteine would help bypass that step, but your homocysteine might get really high - a risk factor for midline defects and blood clots among other things.

Thanks forthe replies.
Yes I do take B6 and mag when I feel I need them. I don't need them as much now it seems. I do want to eat raw animal foods and I am going to try some epsom salt baths.
I am also no longer depressed!:) But I do have gallbladder issues/pain and IgG food intolerances I am trying to heal.

I am still going back and forth on GAPS and thinking I will try more of this approach for a while.

[JenniferS]

I wanted to update that things are going well so far. I am drinking some water kefir and/or danelion root tea before my meals and this is my 3RD DAY OF MAJOR IMPROVEMNT on my gallbladder pain! I will have some more kraut again soon :)

I made a list of the foods I need to speed up Phase I detox a little and support phase II. I am eating gluten-free long-soaked grains and it is really helping me feel like I am not on a "diet". I am also doing anti-candida type foods (coconut oil, raw garlic) because I was on a lot of abx in the past.

I am adding more lifestyle stuff for dexoting (dry skin brushing, more excercises ect)

I am moving away from supplements and more towards food sources since I think it will keep me better balanced. I think I will stay on zinc and vitamin C and magnesuim if I feel I need it. I have taken sooo many supplments over the past few years and they helped the issues I had but I feel a need to do something different. I also feel like getting nutrients from foods is more forgiving and I don't have to have it all figured out if I am nourishing my body well with detox-supportive foods.

I took a B6 and it made me get up all night so I don't think I need that at this time.

PAT-I am really lovng the concept of adding things in and supporting health. I have really had this "getting strict" on myslef mentality for a few years. It's like I have been telling myself that if I don't suffer through some strict diet/hardcore regime then I won't get better and don't deserve to get better..like no pain, no gain. Yikes! Maybe you have some insight on those types of thoughts.

Thanks friends,
Jennifer

[JenniferS]

Failed beet test even with ferments/dandelion. It was mostly in my stool. I think it explains why I am still very anemic o the ferritin test despite lots of meat eating.

Why Broth is Beautiful--"Essential" Roles for Proline, Glycine and Gelatin
By Kaayla T. Daniel, MS CCN

http://www.westonaprice.org/foodfeatures/brothisbeautiful.html
Quote:As Davis put it, "Too little hydrochloric acid impairs protein digestion and vitamin C absorption, allows the B vitamins to be destroyed and prevents minerals from reaching the blood to the extent that anemia can develop and bones crumble."

I need to keep drinking that broth for glycine!

[JenniferS]

Help please :)I am stuck
I cannot figure out if I need more methyl groups/less/ or if my methyl groups are balanced.
I had normal blood homocysteine even in the middle of my PPD crisis. I responded somewhat well to SSRIs, very well to B vitamins, the clinic did NOT think I had high histamine. I had normal blood copper but nonexistent zinc in 2006.
I think I probably had low histamine since I had PPPsychosis/paranoia, imprve on Bs, blood type A
http://www.healthrecovery.com/HRC_2006/Depression_06/D_roller_coast...

Now according to tastes tests I seem to be okay to good in magnesium and zinc. But fail, fail, fail beet test. Must go to sleep

[Shannon]

I keep coming back to zinc and B6. Why?

With pyrolluria and failing the beet test, low zinc is really, really likely. Combine that with low lab results in the past. What form of zinc did you use for the taste test? Zinc sulfate is the only form that I've heard of as a reliable indicator.

With pyrolluria and depression and responsiveness to B vitamins AND a response to B6 (albeit negative), I'm going to say that B6 is a big thing as well. The negative response to B6 alone might just be an imbalance thing. When I'm playing with my supplements, if I see any change at all, I see that as a good thing - I'm guessing it means I added something that my body used. Excess B vitamins tend to just be excreted, so likely, adding more of something that was already in excess would just show no change at all. If the change is a negative one, I interpret that to mean the vitamin got used, but needs something else to balance it.

[JenniferS]

Thanks Shannon,
I did not test with zinc sulfate, I just opened some zinc caps into water. Iwill get some sulfate. I am not having white spots on my nails anymore but I may just just on the edge of not having defiency. Like if I stop zinc I will become defiecient fast. Especially with bf-ing...it is a stress on the body.

Okay, I will keep on 50 mg zinc and 50 mg of B6 to see what happens..
My nutritionist said for me that I could take up to 60mg zinc and 75mg of B6 so that feels safe to me. I am also being conscious to add B and zinc foods.

I am not sure what I need to balance out B6....Maybe B12 and folate?

Something cool is that I am doing very well on adding long-soaked GF grains and lentils. I am not gaining weight immediately (that is what usually happened..I am actually down a couple pounds) Also 4th day without gallbladder pain! YES! I have a feeling stomach acid is going to do wonders for me (protein allergies, low ferritin, gallbladder)

Thanks again,
Jen

[Shannon]

Yay, I'm so glad it's going well. I just did a B complex in addition to my B5/B6, and it did wonders.

You might also be intersted in this article:
http://www.westonaprice.org/moderndiseases/copper-zinc-imbalance.html

[JenniferS]

Thanks, that is a great article..I need to go over it with a highlighter.

I took a 1/2 dose (1 pill) Country Life co-enzymate B-complex recently and I seem to get pins and needles feelings in my extremeties with it. Weird because that is a B vitamin, espcially B6 defiency symptom. I don't get it but it does make me afraid of it (like it is giving me nerve damage..I know that is improbable but anyway)...I got some beef liver today.

Just found this
http://www.holistichealthtopics.com/HMG/Bvitamin.html#Is%20Megavita... Taking about returning symptoms of the defiencies when you address them. (like you were saying about a negative effect means that you needed them) There is good into under "other reactions" onthat page.

Here are zinc, mag and Bs coming together again--
Quote--Adverse reactions caused by inability to convert the B vitamins to their active forms may be addressed by supplements of other nutrients, particularly magnesium, zinc, and riboflavin, which may assist in stimulating the conversion process ( 98 ).

Okay--maybe I don't need to be worried then..oh the complexity of it all!